As VanderKlay’s prominence grew, he found many individuals reaching out to him seeking conversation (or as he says “converZation”) so he began recording them (with permission) and sharing with his YouTube viewers, opening up an innovative new channel for sincere engagement, very much in the spirit of Nuance Forum.

The conversation was deeply engrossing, taking on the existential questions of belief, Christianity in a secular world, Jordan Peterson, and the state of the modern “church.” VanderKlay discussed in depth his efforts to expand the domain for believers and nonbelievers to engage each other in meaningful dialogue, a space he calls “Estuary.”

A particularly interesting segment of the conversation came when VanderKlay was asked if he was redefining what it is to be a pastor, that he seems as interested in conversing with people outside his faith as those within. He offered a candid assessment of where he sees the “church” today, its struggles to remain relevant in an increasingly secular world and described his public role as emphasizing the “missionary” aspect of pastoring a small church.

VanderKlay generously shared almost two and half hours of his time to enliven the Nuance Forum conversation, then the group continued for another hour to engage more deeply with his perspective.

Paul VanderKlay is a pastor with the Living Stones Christian Reform Church in Sacramento, California and a prolific YouTube creator.